I am frustrated almost beyond belief that any Christian can support Obama. Once you get past the soaring rhetoric, you have a man who openly supported infanticide and then lied about it. He is a man who will implement – by his own admission – socialist policies that will harm America. Those policies directly harm the church; they bring people even further away from a reliance on God. He is a man whose campaign has engaged in thuggish tactics, including intimidation to limit others free speech – all things liberals freely accuse George Bush of, but are oddly silent on when it comes to Obama. He is a man who stayed in a church for TWENTY YEARS where his paster felt perfectly comfortable screaming “God damn America!” and engaging in lunatic tin-foil-hatted conspiracy mongering including claiming that the government invented AIDS to kill black people. And on all those things I just listed, Obama has denied, obfuscated, ducked the questions, outright lied about, and when all else fails, claims that such concerns are racist.
Frankly, I look at Christians who support Obama and wonder if they have lost their minds. I don’t like John McCain. But he is BY FAR a better man and a better leader than Barack Obama. I don’t like Hillary, but she deserved the nomination and also would have been a better leader. Each of the things I listed about Obama is proved beyond any shadow of a doubt, no matter how you parse or try to excuse it. Obama says things that sound good, especially in this post-modern culture. But Christians should have better judgment.
Forget the long list of people that he’d have us forget about, including people who have attempted and facilitated murder like Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn and who openly state they are not sorry for doing so. Forget his felon associates like Tony Rezko, who bought the lot next door to the Obamas which is fenced in and part of the Obama’s yard. Forget the fact that he has funneled taxpayer money to his family, friends, and wife’s employer. Forget all that. Infanticide. Not abortion rights, which I still disagree with, but infanticide. WHY isn’t that enough of a reason to repudiate this man? HOW can you support him? I simply do not understand it. Forget the untrue sophistry that Obama’s policies would prevent more abortions that repealing Roe. I’m not talking about abortion. I’m talking about evil; yes, EVIL. Obama voted against a bill that would have provided medical care to babies that survived abortion even though his own committee ensured that it would NOT have affected abortion rights. I’m talking about the character of a man who refused to protect these innocent, helpless victims of abortion. I don’t have to like John McCain or Hillary Clinton to believe that either one of them is a better human being and would make a better president than Barack Obama.
I don’t understand you Christian Obama supporters. I probably will never understand you; how you can claim the high moral ground yet still support this man.
We know from Romans 13 that it is ultimately God who selects our leaders. But believing what I do about Obama (and I have provided the links to support my beliefs, which are well-substantiated) I will do what I can to spread the truth about him and encourage people to vote against him. If he is elected, I will trust in God’s sovereignty and goodness, and remember that
The LORD has made everything for its purpose, even the wicked for the day of trouble.
(Proverbs 16:4)
and that this is ultimately not my home:
They did not receive the things God had promised, but from a long way off they saw them and welcomed them, and admitted openly that they were foreigners and refugees on earth. Those who say such things make it clear that they are looking for a country of their own. They did not keep thinking about the country they had left; if they had, they would have had the chance to return. Instead, it was a better country they longed for, the heavenly country. And so God is not ashamed for them to call him their God, because he has prepared a city for them.
(Hebrews 11:13-16)
Added: in response to Rebecca’s comment and anyone else who wants to accuse me of judging other people’s Christian beliefs: No, I’m not questioning anyone’s salvation (although I also don’t believe that is out of bounds; for example I certainly question Fred Phelp’s salvation and so should you.) Re-read the post. I’m saying, I DO NOT UNDERSTAND YOU AND YOUR PRIORITIES AT ALL. I really don’t. It’s that simple. I don’t get it. I don’t get what moves you.
I am not a one issue voter. I really don’t care whether Roe v. Wade is overturned, for example, because I believe the root problem of abortion needs to be resolved in people’s hearts: we need to learn to want babies more and love ourselves less. That’s my opinion, and I’m entitled to it. (If you read this blog, you’re entitled to it also.) But this isn’t about abortion.
This is a deal-breaker for me. And yes, I did at one time consider voting for Obama – not because I support him but as a strategic vote; because I think McCain, with a Democratic Congress, will successfully pass more laws that I am against, than Obama will with a Dem majority Congress and a determined GOP opposition. I eventually decided, very reluctantly, to support McCain. But after learning that Obama refused to vote to protect these babies, I concluded that there is no way on earth I could ever vote for such a man. This is wrong on such a deep level, it offends me so deeply that I just can’t get past it. I don’t like him for other reasons, reasons that I’ve listed. But even if on every other issue Barack Obama and I were in complete agreement, this one issue would trump it all. How could he do it, and how can you support him, knowing this? The basic facts are not in dispute, they are a matter of public record. This is how he voted, repeatedly. In spite of the fact that his own committee took measures to protect abortion rights, he still could not bring himself to vote to protect these infants. To me, that is a character issue on such a major scale that it trumps everything else.
You have other priorities, like Rebecca? That’s your right. Vote your conscience. My response to Rebecca was inflammatory as was her “oil war” characterization, but really, that’s the bottom line, isn’t it? We’re all going to vote based on what is important to us. That’s how it should be.
As for “judging” and “arrogance” and all that – be honest. Every time we form an opinion, we weigh and measure all kinds of things, and when we finally come to that belief, whatever it is, it is because we have concluded it is superior to the other options. And when other people disagree, if you find them unpersuasive, then you don’t think their belief is equal to yours. You think yours is better. If theirs was better, you would join them. That’s how it works. So let’s not have any of this nonsense about how it’s arrogant and presumptuous. It’s not.
ADDED: Much more on Obama and abortion here.
ADDED x2: Comments closed, mostly because you Obamabots kept repeating the exact same things previous Obamabots had posted; things that had already been repeatedly responded to upthread.
Yes Drew, there are people growing richer at our expense. They don’t charge a fair price for the goods or services they render. They gouge people and charge ridiculous prices. So yes I do believe there are people getting rich at other’s expense. You sound really like a very angry person Drew. Trying to understand that? Do you think everyone is lazy? There should be no social programs? What would your answer be then to a child born with multiple disabilities and its found abandoned? Should we let that child die then because it cannot afford to pay for the doctors and care it needs or its support – i.e feeding, clothing etc? Who then pays for that Drew? How about a woman whose husband either leaves her or dies unexpectedly and she has four kids. She has to feed them and put a roof over their head and try to be a mom and a dad to those kids? She makes 7 to 10 dollars an hour yet rent here in FL would be around 800 to 1000 a month for a home to live in. That doesn’t include food, water, lights, clothing, car expenses to get to the job, daycare…. who helps her the Drew? Is it just her tough luck? She isn’t ambitious enough? Too lazy though she is working two jobs and never sees her kids and still cannot make ends meet? What about that????? Who helps her?
GOD and THE CHURCH and YOU help her. Not Barack Obama. Barack Obama is not God.
But here’s a hint, Kathy: There’s no such thing as an unfair price. You want to know why? Because none of these merchants have to sell you anything. If you want medical prices to go down, why aren’t you a doctor? You seem to think these people owe their services to everybody. Why didn’t you go to medical school? You could give out your services for $10 an hour. I don’t think it’s “fair” how little you’re contributing to the public health.
Of course I don’t think everyone is lazy. I think that if you want something belonging to someone else, you either pay for it, or you do without. If you don’t have enough money to pay for it, you work harder to get more money, or you do without. What God condemns is coveting or stealing from others. Read Proverbs 30:8-9. It condemns stealing, even if you’re poor.
Now let’s look at 1 Samuel 9-18:
Samuel told all the words of the LORD to the people who were asking him for a king. He said:
“This is what the king who will reign over you will do . . . He will take a tenth of your grain and of your vintage and give it to his officials and attendants. . . . He will take a tenth of your flocks, and you yourselves will become his slaves. When that day comes, you will cry out for relief from the king you have chosen, and the LORD will not answer you in that day.”
Man, I wish I could have a king who only took a tenth of my labor!
How can you accuse anyone of being a lesser Christian because of political affiliation.
Political Parties are nothing more than opposite sides of the same evil coin. We as Christians should understand that no establishment of God is perfect, and especially in the case of politics, reek with compromises, deceit, and false pretense.
While, I too, abhor abortion, our vision is too limited to party lines. Please look beyond your party, look beyond your town, and see beyond this country.. God created this world and Jesus died for everyone on this planet, not just American Christians!!!
How about the housands of children who are dead or orphaned in Iraq from our bombs, rising terrorism, disease, and hospitals that continue to lose their electricity.
Do you think God only cares for American Children? Do you think he does not care for Children in Iraq?
Jesus didn’t just DIE for us, but he also LIVED for us Jesus did not LIVE like the self-righteous Christians who rarely venture out of their congregation or country and just criticize far-away people and cultures they do not know.,
He did not stay in the Synagogues and speak ill of the unbelievers outside, he was among those outside, teaching them, and blessing them…
God Loves everyone, and He came as Jesus and Died as the Lamb for ALL people.. not just Bible-wielding Americans in the Mid-West..
How can you vote for the party that put Corporate Profits above human life? At least, in Obama’s case, it is still up to the mother to decide on life…
Though, I hope every mother chooses life, the mothers in Iraq did not have a choice when the life support systems of their newborns suddenly turned off….
As EXXON rakes in the profits, children there continue to die and become orphans….
What of those Children? Or don’t they matter to you? I’m sure they matter to God….
SORRY in my last post I wrote,
‘no estabishment of God is perfect’,
I meant to write,
‘No establishment of Man is perfect’
Any “Christian” who supports Obama is not a real christian. They do not belive in the bible and are slapping our Lord in the face. Any christian who supports Obama also supports abortion and homosexuality. Its that simple. You can not change God and the bible to support your beliefs. That is called Idolitry and any one who does that will face the Lord on judgement day. Obama will not help the middle class by raising taxes on business. Who do you think will pay those taxes, not business, the middle class will when they raise the prices of sevices and products we use. Small business will lay off workers causing more unemployment and big buisness will move out of the country where it is cheaper. We will support those who refuse to work for there money because Obama will give them our money. The bible states “Those who will not work,Shall not eat” Thats biblical.I am an Iraq veteran and when Obama pulls our troops out of Iraq ,the terrorists will be blowing up bombs on our freeways. I am ashamed to be a veteran because of Obama. The USA will not survive another 100 years because we are no better than Sodom. We will destroy ourselves and fake christians who support Obama are helping us along. Satan is laughing at us. His plan is working. Obama is evil and he and all who support him will face the Lord on judgement day. I prey Obama does not win, GOD BLESS AMERICA.
Before you compare killing babies with war, Bernard, read this. And watch this video – if you’ve got the stomach to face what you’re supporting.
If by your argument that you can not be truly Christian and vote Obama, what do you say to the fact that 96% of African-Americans will vote for Obama. In addition African-Americans go to church at a rate higher than the majority community and many of African-Americans who will vote for AA Obama are professing Christians. Many African-American ministers of the Gospel who have dedicated their lives in service to the Kingdom of God, will not only vote for, but encourage others to do so. Many of people who were lost in sinful lifestyles have found redemption and salvation under the guidance of these African-American preachers. Many African-American Christians serving the Kingdom through prayer, worship and Christian service will vote for Obama. So are you saying all these people have no authentic relationship with God, because they vote for Obama. Are you saying that all these people have not had an authentic baptism of the Holy Spirit because they vote for Obama? Are you saying that thier salvation experience and the reception of God’s grace is not authentic because they vote for Obama. Are you saying that 96% of African-Americans do not know God, but you do because you do not vote for Obama? That is not the Jesus I know and see at work everyday in the community that I live. An inner city community that has been forsaken by the privlidged, but still stand because of the grace of Almighty God.
2 Corinthians 9:10-11 — “Now he who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will also supply and increase your store of seed and will enlarge the harvest of your righteousness. You will be made rich in every way so that you can be generous on every occasion, and through us your generosity will result in thanksgiving to God.”
Luke 3:8a, 10-11 — “ ‘Produce fruit in keeping with repentance …’ … ‘What should we do then?’ the crowd asked. John answered, ‘The man with two tunics should share with him who has none, and the one who has food should do the same.’ ”
Acts 20:35b — “[T]he Lord Jesus himself said: ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’ ”
2 Corinthians 8:7, 13-14 — “But just as you excel in everything—in faith, in speech, in knowledge, in complete earnestness and in your love for us—see that you also excel in this grace of giving. … Our desire is not that others might be relieved while you are hard pressed, but that there might be equality. At the present time your plenty will supply what they need, so that in turn their plenty will supply what you need. Then there will be equality …”
Acts 4:32, 34-35 — “All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they had. There were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned lands or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone as he had need.”
James 2:14-17 — “What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to him, ‘Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed,’ but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.”
You can pick your Bible verses to suit your needs Drew, so here are a few of mine. You are 23 years old. Maybe you will see life differently when you add another 23 years to your life and go through some really tough times….You have only just begun to find out what it is all about brother. You don’t know me, you don’t know what I do or how much money I give or whom I help. We all can’t be born to rich parents who pay for everything for us. We all can’t be doctors or lawyers or CEOs of companies so that we never have to worry about our next meal. You talk about the CHURCH helping this lady? Well WE ARE THE CHURCH, its not a building or an organization, its a people. Unfortunately the “churches” I have seen are more ready to spend money on a huge building or a coffe house inside the church or 1.3 million on a christmas pagent (First Baptist of Ft. Lauderdale amongst others) than to help the poor. You said I should help this lady, well I have and I do every chance I get…how often do you spend your time or money doing that Drew? You have a real hang up about people being theives or taking what is yours. Its all God’s not ours. If we earn anything it is by His Grace and its not ours to keep. Jesus didn’t ask the 5000 who was there just for food, who was lazy, who was working, who believed in Him…he just FED them and He LOVED them and we are to do what he does. The greatest of these is LOVE….
Kathy – once again, the bible does not support forced income redistribution. Forced income redistribution does not glorify God; it teaches people that government is the giver of all good things. The verses you listed all support GIVING – not forcible TAKING. (And if you think taxes aren’t forcible, try not paying them for a decade or so and see how that works out for you.) As for what individual churches are blowing money on, I suggest you join one of those churches and work to reform it.
And the multitudes Jesus fed were NOT there “just for food,” they were there to hear Jesus, and He fed them as an example of how He is the bread of life and could meet all their needs. Saying that they were there “just for food” is entirely missing the point of not just those events but of Jesus’ whole mission, which was NOT to eradicate material poverty.
Laura, taxes always were and always will be. I would rather mine be spent on helping the needy than making the Kings at the top richer.
Also that might not have come accross correctly. I didn’t mean they were there for food (the 5000) I meant Jesus did not ask them their REASON for being there. We clearly do not know everyone’s reason for being where Jesus was. Some may have been for the miracles he performed or for the food, or truly to listen to what Jesus had to say. What I mean is Jesus did not ask WHY, he just LOVED them regardless of why they were there. He cared for them as we should care for others.
It seems to me you all say that govt. should not do the work of the church. However I don’t see the “church” doing the work of the church, so someone needs to.
Also it seems like people want the govt. to intervene in what we believe God wants done regarding abortion, yet not in caring for the poor?
[Arrogant, condescending suggestion from Obamabot deleted for sheer hubris. - ed.]
Kathy, read my comment at #14 and refute it on the merits, if you can.
G, #57 – not sure to whom your comment is addressed, but as far as my post is concerned – I AM NOT SAYING THAT OBAMA SUPPORTERS ARE NOT CHRISTIANS. I am saying I don’t understand how a Christian could possibly vote for someone as pro-abortion as Obama is. He intends to remove federal funding for Crisis Pregnancy Centers, for pity’s sake – while still funding Planned Parenthood. That’s just indefensible. So what I’m not doing is saying these people aren’t saved. What I am doing is expressing my bemusement with how they can reconcile the two positions. It simply makes no sense to me whatsoever.
And Mark – on that page you linked – the first three defenses of Obama on abortion are profoundly dishonest, and even include some outright lies. I’m not going to fisk the whole thing, but here’s the first three:
1. there was NOT a law in place in Illinois that said that you always have to supply life-saving treatment to any infant under any circumstances, because babies that survived abortions were being left to die in a hospital closet. That is an irrefutable fact; testified to in Congress and in court, reported by the media, and absolutely not in contention. That is the whole reason that they tried to pass a BAIPA law in Illinois; to force doctors to treat these babies and give them a chance to live.
2. on partial birth abortion – C. Everett Koop and other doctors have testified that it is NEVER necessary to protect the health of the mother. If it were medically necessary to end the pregnancy, that could be done in such a way as to let the baby live, rather than forcing a dangerous breech delivery, punching a hole in the back of the baby’s head and sucking his brains out. So any “health of the mother” excuse is simply dishonest.
3. If Obama is interested in reducing the number of abortions, why is he going to sign FOCA, which when passed on the state level is documented as increasing the number of abortions, and why is he going to – by his own admission – cut funding for CPCs while increasing funding for Planned Parenthood, the largest abortion provider in the country?
[MY REPLY IS IN-LINE, BRACKETED AND IN ALL CAPS - LAURA]
While your comments in post 14 are compelling and I admire the fact that you through the grace of God you were able to overcome tough times, that does not address the issue of dismissing the spiritual authenticity of the 96% of African-Americans that will vote for Obama. Are you saying that we are not Christians? [POINTS OFF YOUR READING COMPREHENSION SCORE, G. I HAVE SAID REPEATEDLY THAT I DO NOT QUESTION THE SALVATION OF OBAMA VOTERS. ] Often people quote Jesus “the poor will always be among us” as an explanation for not helping their neighbors laying on the side of the road. However the poor will always be amongs us is not first spoken by Jesus, but is taken from the book of Deuteronomy chapter 15
“There will always be poor people in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your brothers and toward the poor and needy in your land.”
Deut 15:11
But what is interesting is what is said before that text.
” However, there should be no poor among you, for in the land the Lord your God is giving you to possess as your inheritance, he will richly bless you,if only you fully obey the Lord your God and are careful to follow all these commands I am giving you today. For the Lord your God will bless you as he has promised, and you will lend to many nations but will borrow from none. You will rule over many nations but none will rule over you. If there is a poor man among your brothers in any of the towns of the land that the Lord your God is giving you, do not be hardhearted or tightfisted toward your poor brother. Rather be openhanded and freely lend him whatever he needs. Be careful not to harbor this wicked thought: “The seventh year, the year for canceling debts, is near,” so that you do not show ill will toward your needy brother and give him nothing. He may then appeal to the Lord against you, and you will be found guilty of sin. Give generously to him and do so without a grudging heart; then because of this the Lord your God will bless you in all your work and in everything you put your hand to.”
I agree with you that it is the church’s responsibilty to help the poor, but the church does not do it. [SO LIKE ABRAHAM, WHO WAS TIRED OF WAITING FOR GOD'S PLAN TO COME TO FRUITION, YOU THINK WE SHOULD JUST COME UP WITH OUR OWN PLAN AND FORCIBLY REDISTRIBUTE INCOME? IF YOUR PROBLEM IS THAT THE CHURCH IS NOT COMPLYING WITH GOD'S PLAN (AND I AGREE IT IS NOT) THE THE PROBLEM IS WITH THE CHURCH, NOT WITH GOD'S PLAN. THEREFORE IT IS THE CHURCH WHICH MUST CHANGE, NOT THE PLAN.] God promised the people an abundance when they went into the promise land. Enough to make sure all would have the opportunity to enjoy all the Lord had blessed the community. However, God was concerned that the people would become greedy and not share with their brothers and sisters. As a result the declaration that the poor would be among us, not because of God’s lack of suply, [JESUS DECLARED THAT THE POOR WILL BE WITH US ALWAYS IN THE NEW TESTAMENT - AND OUR PURPOSE IS TO GLORIFY GOD, NOT TO ERADICATE POVERTY, WHICH IS IMPOSSIBLE. THAT WE DO SO BY SERVING THE POOR IS THE METHOD, NOT THE GOAL.] but because of the greed in the heart of man. That is America’s problem, we are a greedy nation that does not want to share the wealth with one another. [AMERICANS GIVE MORE GENEROUSLY THAN ANY OTHER COUNTRY; BOTH AS A NATION GIVING TO OTHER NATIONS, AND AS INDIVIDUAL DONORS] The bible is clear God owns the land not man, corporations or governments. I am not advocating the government take care of the people, but I do believe government should be fair. [WHAT'S FAIR ABOUT FORCIBLY TAKING THE PRODUCTS OF MY LABOR AND GIVING IT TO SOMEONE ELSE?] In America, the people are the government and the people are the church. It is up to Christians to apply Kingdom principles to a nation that places profits over people. [SO, THE SAME WAY SHARIA LAW ENFORCED DHIMMITUDE ON NON-MUSLIMS WITH THE JIZYA TAX, YOU THINK CHRISTIANS SHOULD FORCE PEOPLE OF OTHER FAITHS OR NO FAITH TO COMPLY WITH OUR RELIGIOUS MANDATES? HOW IS THAT GOING TO SHOW THEM LOVE AND BRING THEM INTO THE KINGDOM?] Was the $ 700 billion bailout to bankers who benefit from usury, another concept the bible teaches against, justice. My concern with you and others who proclaim some divine right to determine whether someone is a Christian based on who they vote for [I HAVE NOT DONE THAT; NOW YOU'RE JUST MAKING STUFF UP.], is that labels people based on your beliefs and not what the Word says. So I will ask again, if 96% of African-Americans vote for Obama, including African-American Christians, does this mean that they are not real Christians. That their born-again experience was not authentic? That somehow we do not know God, because we choose a different political position than you. [KEEP CHASING THAT STRAW MAN SO YOU CAN KNOCK IT DOWN, G. I DON'T THINK YOU'RE STUPID, SO I'M FORCED TO CONCLUDE YOU ARE WILLFULLY MISREPRESENTING MY POSITION, WHICH I HAVE STATED CLEARLY MANY TIMES.]
One final question, if a Christian evangelical president really believes that abortion is wrong, why has he not issued an executive order banning it and make congress and the courts declare his actions unconstitutional. Then they could have a very public fight on the merits and morality of Roe v. Wade and it would be on the public record. Name one thing these republicans have done to reduce abortions [LIKE PASS THE BAN ON PARTIAL BIRTH ABORTIONS AND FUND CRISIS PREGNANCY CENTERS, FOR EXAMPLE? PLEASE NOTE THAT WHEN OBAMA SIGNS FOCA IT WILL UNDO THAT BAN, ALONG WITH STATE LEVEL THINGS WE HAVE FOUGHT FOR LIKE PARENTAL NOTIFICATION AND INFORMED CONSENT], other than say they are against to get evangelicals to elect them and then blame the democrats for not be able to do anything. Take a stand, take a politcal risk, do you really think McCain/Palin are going to do anything that tell you one thing and then do what other republicans have done once they get in office, maintain the status quo. Let’s stay focused on our true calling, spreading the love of Christ to a hurting world as opposed to condeming people who love Jesus just as much as you do, who have been brougth through hard times just like you, who have experienced the power of the Holy Spirit just as you do, who cry out to God everynight for thier friends, family and community just as you do, who are moved to tears in the presence of an almighty God as we worship the Lord in Spirit and truth in our houses of worship just are you are. Stopping calling people un-Christian because of how they vote, be aware when you say that you are alienting an entire race of people as wel as creating unneccesary division in the body of Christ.
[MY MAIN PROBLEM AT THIS POINT, G, IS THAT YOU ARE MISREPRESENTING MY POSITION AND I THINK YOU KNOW IT. FOR THE LAST TIME; I HAVE NEVER CLAIMED THAT CHRISTIANS WHO VOTE FOR OBAMA ARE NOT CHRISTIANS. I THINK YOU'RE DEAD WRONG, CONFUSED, OFTEN WILLFULLY IGNORANT OF WHAT YOU ARE SUPPORTING, AND FOR YOU "SOCIAL JUSTICE" TYPES, EMPLOYING A PROFOUND MISUNDERSTANDING OF THE GREAT COMMISSION, BUT I DO NOT THINK YOU ARE UNSAVED.]
Words are powerful. When you make claims of someone being a socialist and supporter of infanticide, I would argue you are misrepresenting Obama’s position. Evoking Abe Lincoln’s name does not help, he also wrote that if he could keep slavery and keep the union together he would, but that is entire different topic. African-Americans know about having things forcibly taking from them, like our freedom for labor to build this nation. Our experiences and heritage often inform our theology and the decisions that we make. I know you may not understand why some Christians are supporting Obama, but the fact is many are. I hope this election does not do more to divide the body of Christ racially, but it will if the evangelicals label him as an “evil, baby killing socialist”. Think about what those statements may sound like to people who are inspired by him and what he represents. The ability to overcome seemingly insurmountable odds to ascend to the highest office in the nation. This is inspiring for people who were denied the opportunity to vote, like my grandparents in a segregated south, that was supported and protected by many so-called Christians. By God’s grace we have overcome that and we stand in a place that will either bring our nation together or tear it apart. As Christians we can not allow this election to place a further divide in the body of Christ, that is usually drawn on racial lines. Please be careful in how you use words and know that when you pose questions such as how can a Christian do anything, you will run the risk of being used as tool of division. There are some who may question your right to even have a comment on matters of faith, for some texts support the silence of women. This is not a position I would take and I would defend you against such teaching. Just be sensitive to the fact that an overwhelming number of African-American Christians support Obama and we still love Jesus and always will no matter what happens on election day
Argue it all you want, G, but with something that will refute the facts I’ve presented, not with baseless assertions. Obama does support abortion in every possible way, and he has stated that he intends to defund programs like Crisis Pregnancy Centers which discourage abortion. That’s not my opinion; like his votes, these things are established fact – reported in the media, and not things he even disputes.
His support of Planned Parenthood is especially deplorable, given that it was founded in order to create a black genocide. Margaret Sanger, PP founder, wrote: “We do not want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population, and the minister is the man who can straighten that idea out if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members.” and her views are well documented. You can find that and more at this site – including this food for thought:
You imply that my opposition of Obama is racist:
A convenient way to shut down argument! But it’s fundamentally dishonest, and I think deep down you know it. Because Obama is a black man, is he exempt from criticism for his views? Is that really what you want? Is that the equality MLK fought for?
I don’t care what color he is; he’s a major abortion supporter and his views are in fact socialist: forced income redistribution. He’s hung out with socialists and far leftists his entire adult life. That’s who he is. Those are the views he promotes. If Nancy Pelosi were running for President, I would say these exact same things about her. In fact, I’ve often said them about her and she’s not running. This is not a race thing at all. It’s about him, and his views, and what he will do if elected.
Hi everyone
I just wanted to give all you Christians something to think about. I hope that you will all seriously take the time to really consider this.
In supporting Obama, I don’t care how any of you rationalize it, you are not and I repeat NOT standing on the side of God.(Before you get upset let me explain why that is)
First we all have to come to the understanding that the bible is God’s word.
Second we need to believe that it is vitally important to stand on God’s side. Read Ezekiel 22:30-31
Here God explains that he looked for someone to build the wall of righteousness that guards the land and stand in the gap so that he would not have to destroy the land. Think about Sodom and Gomorrah.
Now let’s discuss standing on God’s side.
1) Abortion: God said that he knew you before the womb. He also said it is against his will to kill.(6th commandment). Even in the case of rape, I don’t believe it is okay to take the life of the fetus. We need to use those unfortunate circumstances that test our faith, to show that we believe that God is in control and that he will make good out of the worst situations. Trust in him.
2) Marriage: Marriage was designed by God between a man and a woman. This is the reason he did not make two Adams in the garden. He is a God of order and has placed opposite gender for his specific purpose. (read Romans 1:18 – 32)Allowing gay marriage is against God’s will.
3)According to Obama, (Let’s spread the wealth around). Government taxes are to be paid because all forms of authority are established by God and he said that we should pay taxes because government workers have to be paid.(Romans 13: 1-7)Taxes should not be used to spread the wealth around. According to (2Thessalonians 3:6-14) Paul spcifically stated that those unwilling to work will not get to eat. He commanded such people to stop meddling in other people’s business and work to earn their own living. He did however encourage those who are working to never get tired of doing good. We should give freely to the less fortunate but it is not the government’s responsibility to take from one group who is working to earn their living and give it to someone else. If you believe that the rich should give you the money they earn then you are breaking the 10th commandment, Do not covet your neighbor’s belongings.
4) War in Iraq. God has blessed many wars throughout the Bible, and although I believe that it was the wrong war to fight, we are already there. Now we need to do the right thing. We cannot abandond the Iraqi people right as they are about to make a difference and alow their country to slip into something far worst. Iran could invaded this country with their radical ideology and we would have to go back there again in a far worst situation than before.
The important thing is that God does not change his mind. He is the same today as he is tomorrow. We need to choose a side and that side should be to follow God.
Abortions, gay marriages, spreading the wealth around is not God’s side. If you are not on his side on the issues, don’t fool yourself, you are against him. To me, Obama is a great speaker and he says the things the world wants to hear, but remember thw world and God are in total opposition so choose wisely and I hope this will convict your heart to stand on God’s side. Anyone teaching you other wise is not teaching you God’s word.
Thanks for listening and read those verses.
Laura,
I just googled Christians for Obama to see what came up, somewhat fearful of what I might find. You are one gutsy lady and you have done your research well. I applaud you! Thanks for trying to make a positive differnce for our nation and world. Some of the pro-Obama websites I looked at were absolutely appalling. I was sickened at the vitriolic language and accusations some of these people were making against conservatives who are fellow Christians. This is hardly what Jesus had in mind in John 17. Our disunity is a terrible example and distracts us from the mission God has called us to. Blessings upon you!
Khian, on your #2 – Obama does not support gay marriage. In fact, of all the people on either ticket, Palin probably comes closest to supporting gay marriage, by her decision to provide taxpayer funded benefits to same sex partners in Alaska.
Obama on homosexual issues:
Diana, thanks, you’re very kind! Although I don’t agree that yapping on the way I do is gutsy.
Hope you’ll stick around and join in the discussions!
Laura,
Civil Unions are also against God’s law. In the Bible it is called sexual immorality. So if Obama supports civil unions he is still against God.
G
96% of African Americans are voting for Obama because he is an African American. Wake up. This is in truth racism. God isn’t gonna accept a man because of the color of his skin. I asked many African Americans why they are voting for Obama.
#1 response: he is a blackman and he is going to do alot for other blackmen
#2 response: if your black and don’t vote for obama you are an uncle tom
#3 response: we are going to make history with a blackman in the whitehouse
I did not hear anything in those responses about God.
This world we live in is messed up.. and unfortunately can not be fixed in our life time. Homosexuality, abortions will exist no matter who ends up president. As a Christian, I am voting for OBAMA. The reason is this… we are to love God with all our soul AND love everyone as we love ourselves. These are the greatest commandments right? Based on that Obama is for the poor, the needy and the oppressed (illegal immigrants). What did Jesus do while on earth? He helped the sick, the poor and the oppressed. WE are called Christians right? It is not enough people to tithe, go to church and be religious.
Patty, Jesus did not forcibly take money from one group and give it to another. He told us to do it voluntarily, which glorifies God. Socialism does not glorify God; it teaches people that the government is the giver of all good things.